Early O.S.C.A saloons, 1971-75 era, any pics out there b/w or colour?

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Originally Posted by nzboss

Hey Paul it would be neat to hear more of the Weslake Chevy.
I remember it being for sale...the engine...years ago.
From memory it had been in a jet boat?
It is still in NZ somewhere, I remember reading about it in the NZHRM a year or 2 ago.
A grouse looking engine!!!

Rodney

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Some details re Weslake 4 valve Chev 350, ex Bellis-----
The short block was just the usual racing small block v8, Steel GM crank, Carillos, roller cam, roller chain cam drive, forged pistons etc but the pistons were flat tops, in fact slightly recessed, and dry sumped with Weaver 3 stage pump.
The heads were were designed to just bolt on with a minimum of modification and had beautifull porting, twin rocker shafts, 2 inlet and 2 exhaust valves per cylinder that were operated by forked cast steel rockers with an adjusting screw at the pushrod end. (Tappet adjustment was done by grinding the lash caps so you had equal clearence at both valves, then adjusting the final clearences with the screw). The valve stems were same diameter as BMC A series and quite/very long, the heads quite small and the valve lift was quite low. It also had individule intake runners with slide throttle plates and Scintiller Vertex magneto locked with no advance and Lucas timed mechanical fuel injection. (To get it to idle at acceptable rpm I fitted an electronic distributor with centrifugal advance so the timing at idle was retarded because the throttles leaked so much air it idled way too fast.
The weakness with the engine design was the angles of the pushrods especially the inlets. Even thought they were 3/8 diameter hardened chrome molly tube they still flexed excessively as evidenced by the contact markings, yet when turning the engine by hand there was plenty of clearence!
When first running it on the dyno I was impressed by the exhaust noise, it was beautiful music! And produced 605 bhp at 6000 rpm, with a flat torque curve from 2500rpm. The power fell off very quick over 6500 due to the flexing pushrods losing valve control. Then we encountered issues with inlet valve springs, (breaking), and the valve covers and valley filling up with oil due to excessive oiling to the valve gear and poor drainage, this caused oil leaks and loss of oil pressure due to low level in the dry sump tank an probably aireation. These problems explained why Bellis could only do a couple of laps at a time before blowing smoke and oil at the two meetings he raced it at (Puke and Bay Park) After modifying the oiling system and the inlet rocker geometry and springs/retainers it started to go pretty well.
Roy Grainger raced it quite successfully in his leaf sprung old technology super saloon speedway car with a Powerglyde auto with no torque converter/clutch, locked in 2nd gear, but cooling was a problem so I converted it to run on methanol, this kept it cooler and gave if more power as well. (Not that it needed more)
I spent many hours on that project and learned heaps, didn't charge enough, but I enjoyed it and have a soft spot for that engine.
PK.

Paul,that is one good summary of events there in your final sentence you say you had a soft spot for that engine ,I understand what you are saying and how you feel,there has been more that a couple of projects I have felt that way about even though they gave me plenty of grief along the way you become part of them I guess and look back on them with fond memories

That's great information Paul.
And well written.
Thank you.

Rodney

Wow, Paul, thats a really good read! Thanks for posting.

A few pictures I took at Ruapuna in November 1972 maybe with an instamatic or box Brownie!

I think this was an early outing for the Collins Cortina
Attachment 4421

Again maybe the first or an early outing for the Sylvester Monaro. What happened to this car?
Attachment 4422

Before the Starlet was the Corolla, again what happened to this Crowe car?
Attachment 4423

McPhail and Hammond Escorts
Attachment 4424
Attachment 4425

When at varsity a friend had one of these mildly worked over as a road car and I always wanted one (still do actually)
Attachment 4426

OSCA wasn't all about the big capacity cars, a couple more from Ruapuna Nov 1972. The driver's names escape me.
Attachment 4427
Attachment 4428

Hey these are great! I've also wondered what happened to the Sylvester Monaro. It didn't race for long did it. Then is vanished. Looks like there was a bit of carnage at that event. Both the Monaro and Collins Cortina have damage. The Crowe Chevy Corolla ended up in Palmerston North, owned by Mike Moore (I think). My understanding is that it was eventually scrapped.

777B is Barry Vuyk.

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Originally Posted by woody

777B is Barry Vuyk.

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That XU1 powered 100E Prefect was quite a car. I'm not sure what happened to it when Barry moved onto the Stilletto-Ford.

It was bought by Don Peddie I believe, I remember him running it in OSCA a couple of times...then it probably went to the Peddie farm to retire...:) quite a few toys ended up there .....

The A30, IIRC there was one Ford powered & one with Triumph 2000 power anyone know more?

The Torana/XU-1 behind the Hammond x Crosbie/Simpson? Escort could be Peter 'bloody' Kocis (spl?)

All this stuff is not good for me.. If you wanted a wide rim..you made it... roll cage..make it...flare a wheel arch...just cut the inner out,weld it on the outside...fill in the gaps....Hell OSCA even paid prize money per event & then a bonus at season end on points earned during the season... Now what happens, pay a big entry fee, sign your life away in case you hurt someone, pay a fine if some turkey sitting 'on high' deems you were not far enough forward to actually pass...throw away perfectly good crash hats & belts every couple of years...dont even think about making your own wheels or roll cage, just be a good boy now and even though you can see the gaps in the welds of your MSNZ certified cage made by an 'expert', that little scrap of paper & the photos will stop it falling around your ears..use this fuel-yep we know its quality drops off after a couple of weeks, wont matter if your pistons melt, BTW, get the noise down a bit will you... Oh, and the prize money etc...we got over that..the new unwritten rule is that entertainers pay to do so in the name of progress...

Jac Mac.......you are a bitter and twisted old man!!!!!! Unfortunately, you are dead right.

JUST RIGHT, Gerald....not quite dead ...yet!!!:)...... isnt there an old quote?.... it takes one to recognise one....

PS, that is why I get much pleasure from sneaking as many old school ideas into Jack Ondracks TVR as I can...:):)

No.....'it takes one to KNOW one'.......yep, thats me!!!!!!!

Jac Mac, So right. The belts has me buggered. Car may be used 3 to 4 times and sits in workshop with cover but no, those belts are 2 years old now so you can not use them. (this is with classic rally car) no doubt by sound of it same with curcuit. i am putting my curcuit car back together so look forward to "you can not have that, that is not acceptable, you will have to change your roll cage".
Any way looking forward to this week end at Ruapuna, will be good.

AMEN to all that jac mac

on the subject of belts.
Now my thought process is gone this way which is no good at all
Do i buy a set of quallity belts, say willans or similar, knowing they will end up in the bin?
Tempting just to buy some cheap CHINA ones with the correct tap

takes me back to a fine i got a few years ago.
Turned up with the manz number on the cage, but no paper work.

"where is the paper work?"
"shit sorry left at home, but manz has a copy. anyway has a number here, see"
" Did you just stamp that on yourself"
"Sorry, parden me"
Heres the fine, complain to manz!!!!!!
Jesus Thanks!!!!!!!!

And your so right, paid the entry fee, fuel, tyres etc etc so the paying public can have some entitainment
I do scratch my head at times.

Apologies for the moan, it wont happen again

Have a good time @ Ruapuna guys, unfortunately [ or perhaps some might see it as fortunate :) ] I wont be there, have been talking to Anthony Prendergast though about the old MKII, they hope to have it down at Teretonga in December for OSCA round so I might get a look see then...

Rodgered... it would seem to me that you should start importing 'parallel' Willans labels & sewing them into the cheapo chinese belts, might help pay for your race car:).

Some great photos there just to remind us of what the racing used to be like. I can see why we miss it so much.

And a few more from Ruapuna March 1975. Sorry about the quality but I was developing and printing my own photos back then

The Bates V8 Torana
Attachment 4475

Dymond V8 Capri
Attachment 4476

Vivas V8 and V6 - Brown and Kirk and if I remember correctly the Kirk Viva was always the quicker
Attachment 4478

Diversity in Murdoch's Datsun 1300, the Ryan TC, Grant 2L Escort and the Prattley "S". This is what I used to love about that time - the variety of cars and engines
Attachment 4479

and Bell's "S" following McPhail's Escort (which I never thought went as well as his old Farina)
Attachment 4477

Weren't they great cars and the variety of makes run in those days. Photographer looks like he is in a hurry to get out of the way. Maybe he could see something that we can't.

These are great! What happened to all these cars? I understand the Dymand Capri was scrapped? Does the Bates Torana still exist? How about the Vivas?

Im just worried that it might have been me:).. IIRC there were a couple of pics in Autonews about that time, one was of Ron McPhail in the escort as pictured, the other was of my Ford powered Imp.... the intent of the photo comparision at the time was to show different camber angles etc... needless to say, the Imp with its swing arm front & trailing arm rear did not have two wheels pointing in the same direction..

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Originally Posted by kiwi285

Weren't they great cars and the variety of makes run in those days. Photographer looks like he is in a hurry to get out of the way. Maybe he could see something that we can't.

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Hi guys. First post for me. Re the Weslake chev engine. What Paul did with this engine was truly amazing. I was Roy Grangers crew during this time. Ihave photos with roker covers off that i will post Cheers IAN.

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Originally Posted by bob homewood

Paul,that is one good summary of events there in your final sentence you say you had a soft spot for that engine ,I understand what you are saying and how you feel,there has been more that a couple of projects I have felt that way about even though they gave me plenty of grief along the way you become part of them I guess and look back on them with fond memories

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Welcome to the site Ian, I look forward to seeing those photos.

Attachment 4606Attachment 4607Here are the pictures.

Wow, Ian, thanks so much for posting these. What a stunning piece of kit! Is that the engine bay of the Cortina its fitted into?

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Originally Posted by Steve Holmes

Wow, Ian, thanks so much for posting these. What a stunning piece of kit! Is that the engine bay of the Cortina its fitted into?

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No sorry Steve the Cortina ute was 2.5L v6 powered. The Weslake headed Chev was used in the Roy Granger speedway Monza as discussed by Paul Kirk. Paul claimed to have a soft spot for this motor which was a bit of an understatment. To stand in PK's dyno room and put my hand on this engine while it is under full load at 6500 rpm was a feeling I will never forget.

Is this the Roy Granger that had a very nice Commer Cob ,orange with ,Brabham mags full house 1725,used to cruise around the square on a Sat night, legend

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Originally Posted by ian

No sorry Steve the Cortina ute was 2.5L v6 powered. The Weslake headed Chev was used in the Roy Granger speedway Monza as discussed by Paul Kirk. Paul claimed to have a soft spot for this motor which was a bit of an understatment. To stand in PK's dyno room and put my hand on this engine while it is under full load at 6500 rpm was a feeling I will never forget.

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Thanks Ian. I thought this was the motor that was also used in the Bellis Cortina? Thats the Cortina I was referring to when I asked what engine bay that was. Or am I talking about a completely different engine?

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Originally Posted by Gerard Richards

I've always been a bit fascinated with the early era of O.S.C.A. Living in Auckland we didn't really see much of it but it all sounded pretty exciting down south. I remember on one occasion in early 1973, there was a sort of O.S.C.A. tour to the north, with several meetings. By the time they got to Pukekohe there had been several mechanical casualties, but I clearly remember Paul Kirk's yellow Viva with red wheels?, (really liked that car and it went well) and 3.5 Buick V8 motor, Blair Paton and Ron McPhail in there respective blue and black twin cam Escorts, plus Peter Kocis in his Torana, also possibly Grant Aitken in his 1450 Mini and Pat Pascoe's light weight ex McRae Twin Cam powered A40. I remember Kocis and Jim Richards in the Sidchrome Imp had a coming together shortly after the start with the Imp launched through the fence. I'd be really keen to sight some pictures of the early years of OSCA, in the pits on the track wherever, particularly from down south if anyone has any gems stowed away!

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Giday Gearald,
I remember that Puke meeting that some of us OSCA guys went to!
Thanks for your kind words re the Viva Buick, actually it didnt suit that track for 2 reasons, (probably many more if I really thought about it), and they were (1) it was under geared so I had to throttle off down the straights, (I'd flogged the diff out of my road going XU1, 3.08:1, but it needed to be higher), (2) also around the sweeper after the start/finish line it felt extremely unstable, (this was unusual as the car was normally good in fast corners), this was due, as I discovered later, to the rear axles flexing! I know this seems strange but I had been having trouble twisting axles at the splines (they were Hillman Minx axles) so I'd waisted them down to just under the root diametre of the splines so the loads would be absorbed by the torsional flex/twist thereby reducing the concentration of the load on the spline. What I didn't think about was that the axles were also subject to bending strain when cornering, so I suspect the outside rear wheel was taking on positive camber or whatever else it wanted to do when subjected to high cornering loads!
And there was another issue---I remember the last race was a handicap event so I took off determined to make as much ground as possible, anyway down the back straight as the race wore on, I caught up to a Mini just before the CHICANE, yeah thats right, they put some Euclid tyres halfway down the straight in the form of an "S" bend! anyway I had to back right off and let the Mini go through first, by this time all the big V8s had cought up (and passed) so I just cruised to the end.
But I did enjoy going up North, and I actually won the North Island OSCA Championship outright, (the Viva was "B" class), but that was only due to the fact that I went North more often than the others from down here!
But they were GOOD days in those days, things have changed a bit and I haven't made up my mind whether it's for better of for worse!
PK.

Hi 105 angria. Probly berore I khew him but sounds right. Always was and still is a petrolhead. Living in Brisbane. His son races speedway salons very succesfully.
Sorry Steve for confusion. Yes definatly same engine. Photo is in Monza speedway salon re Paul Kirks earlier post.
Paul your Viva went the way of so many older cars. I worked at Williams Auto Wreckers in Kaipoi and remember the day it went through the crusher.

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Originally Posted by 105angria

Is this the Roy Granger that had a very nice Commer Cob ,orange with ,Brabham mags full house 1725,used to cruise around the square on a Sat night, legend

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Originally Posted by Jac Mac

It was bought by Don Peddie I believe, I remember him running it in OSCA a couple of times...then it probably went to the Peddie farm to retire...:) quite a few toys ended up there .....

The A30, IIRC there was one Ford powered & one with Truimph 2000 power anyone know more?

The Torana/XU-1 behind the Hammond x Crosbie/Simpson? Escort could be Peter 'bloody' Kocis (spl?)

All this stuff is not good for me.. If you wanted a wide rim..you made it... roll cage..make it...flare a wheel arch...just cut the inner out,weld it on the outside...fill in the gaps....Hell OSCA even paid prize money per event & then a bonus at season end on points earned during the season... Now what happens, pay a big entry fee, sign your life away in case you hurt someone, pay a fine if some turkey sitting 'on high' deems you were not far enough forward to actually pass...throw away perfectly good crash hats & belts every couple of years...dont even think about making your own wheels or roll cage, just be a good boy now and even though you can see the gaps in the welds of your MSNZ certified cage made by an 'expert', that little scrap of paper & the photos will stop it falling around your ears..use this fuel-yep we know its quality drops off after a couple of weeks, wont matter if your pistons melt, BTW, get the noise down a bit will you... Oh, and the prize money etc...we got over that..the new unwritten rule is that entertainers pay to do so in the name of progress...

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Hay Jac, the 2 A30s you refer to could well be the Kerry Rout Triumph 2000 one and the Jeff Whealan Ford 1340 examples. As usual there are storys attatched to most of the old cars but briefly re Kerry's car--it was built by Colin Berryman, (I'm sure his name will be famillia to many here, sadly not with us any more), and used 3 of those little 35mm Webers and had a funny rear suspension linkage that promoted roll-steer.
I was testing it at Ruapuna one day and to my surprise when braking for the hairpin it sort-of swayed one way and my automatic reaction was to aply steering input to counteract it, then it swayed the other way, and so on and so on! Quite un-nerving! When discussing it with Kerry he said you just said hold the steering wheel straight and it might sway a bit but it always went straight. Unfortunately some idiot from Wellington in a MIni drove into the side of Kerry at Rothmans corner and the poor old A30 ended up like a banana and that was the end of that! And re Jeff's 1340 A30, complete with A3 Cosworth cam and 28-36 DCD Weber, (actually it might have been a Weber off a Ford V6 were both butterflies open similtaniously), it didn't go too bad but one day at Timaru it went better than usual! Why? Well there had been a bit of a "do" Sat night and Jeff didn't make it to his bed so went straight to Levels and the effects of the lack of sleep/booze was noticed by some of the others at drivers' briefing but nothing was said and Jeff really threw the car around that day! The following Timaru meeting the guy (whose name I can't remember) that was conducting the briefing made it quite clear that sort of behaviour would NOT be tollerated in future!
Them were the days!!!!
PK.

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Originally Posted by 105angria

Is this the Roy Granger that had a very nice Commer Cob ,orange with ,Brabham mags full house 1725,used to cruise around the square on a Sat night, legend

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Yeah, I think it was the same guy.
PK

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Originally Posted by ian

Hi 105 angria. Probly berore I khew him but sounds right. Always was and still is a petrolhead. Living in Brisbane. His son races speedway salons very succesfully.
Sorry Steve for confusion. Yes definatly same engine. Photo is in Monza speedway salon re Paul Kirks earlier post.
Paul your Viva went the way of so many older cars. I worked at Williams Auto Wreckers in Kaipoi and remember the day it went through the crusher.

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Ian? That isn't "Cheddar" is it? I've got a feeling it might be. If you're in Ch Ch/Kaiapoi any time, my details are all in the phone book, it'd be good to catch up. And re the Viva, a guy from Ashburton tracked it down with the aim of rebuilding it, but arived at Williams just a couple of days after it was crushed! Buggar!
PK.

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Originally Posted by Jac Mac

It was bought by Don Peddie I believe, I remember him running it in OSCA a couple of times...then it probably went to the Peddie farm to retire...:) quite a few toys ended up there .....

The A30, IIRC there was one Ford powered & one with Truimph 2000 power anyone know more?

The Torana/XU-1 behind the Hammond x Crosbie/Simpson? Escort could be Peter 'bloody' Kocis (spl?)

All this stuff is not good for me.. If you wanted a wide rim..you made it... roll cage..make it...flare a wheel arch...just cut the inner out,weld it on the outside...fill in the gaps....Hell OSCA even paid prize money per event & then a bonus at season end on points earned during the season... Now what happens, pay a big entry fee, sign your life away in case you hurt someone, pay a fine if some turkey sitting 'on high' deems you were not far enough forward to actually pass...throw away perfectly good crash hats & belts every couple of years...dont even think about making your own wheels or roll cage, just be a good boy now and even though you can see the gaps in the welds of your MSNZ certified cage made by an 'expert', that little scrap of paper & the photos will stop it falling around your ears..use this fuel-yep we know its quality drops off after a couple of weeks, wont matter if your pistons melt, BTW, get the noise down a bit will you... Oh, and the prize money etc...we got over that..the new unwritten rule is that entertainers pay to do so in the name of progress...

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Hay Jac, the 2 A30s you refer to could well be the Kerry Rout Triumph 2000 one and the Jeff Whealan Ford 1340 examples. As usual there are storys attatched to most of the old cars but briefly re Kerry's car--it was built by Colin Berryman, (I'm sure his name will be famillia to many here, sadly not with us any more), and used 3 of those little 35mm Webers and had a funny rear suspension linkage that promoted roll-steer.
I was testing it at Ruapuna one day and to my surprise when braking for the hairpin it sort-of swayed one way and my automatic reaction was to aply steering input to counteract it, then it swayed the other way, and so on and so on! Quite un-nerving! When discussing it with Kerry he said you just said hold the steering wheel straight and it might sway a bit but it always went straight. Unfortunately some idiot from Wellington in a MIni drove into the side of Kerry at Rothmans corner and the poor old A30 ended up like a banana and that was the end of that! And re Jeff's 1340 A30, complete with A3 Cosworth cam and 28-36 DCD Weber, (actually it might have been a Weber off a Ford V6 were both butterflies open similtaniously), it didn't go too bad but one day at Timaru it went better than usual! Why? Well there had been a bit of a "do" Sat night and Jeff didn't make it to his bed so went straight to Levels and the effects of the lack of sleep/booze was noticed by some of the others at drivers' briefing but nothing was said and Jeff really threw the car around that day! The following Timaru meeting the guy (whose name I can't remember) that was conducting the briefing made it quite clear that sort of behaviour would NOT be tollerated in future!
Them were the days!!!!
PK.

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Originally Posted by bob homewood

Modestly yes ! Peter Kocis was just in front, gone out of the photo Dick Young is in the other Torana,I think that is the Triang following me Murray Soames is in the Lotus Cortina ,he went on to build a Escort with all the Lotus
Cortina components in it,this Escort was later brought by Bryce Platt ,developed more and became his Championship
winning car.Murray was another of the founding members of that early Auckland OSCA chapter,I think he also looked
hard at that time at the Olds F85 option

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Hay Bob, if my memory serves me right Greg Lancaster and Rex Findlay were also active Auckland OSCA branch members.
PK.

It surely is Paul. Live in Invercargill now. Will be up at Xmas for family and friends and will try to catch you then.

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Originally Posted by Paul Kirk

Hay Bob, if my memory serves me right Greg Lancaster and Rex Findlay were also active Auckland OSCA branch members.
PK.

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Yes that is right ,Myself Greg,Rex,and Adrian Walmsley ? I think were the original comitte,we used to have the monthly club night over in some place in Panmure,Rex and I used to run the gauntlet before evey club night picking up the evenings refreshments from that dodgy pub in Mt Wellington,pity the fuel crisis thing came along because I reckon it would have worked up here

Warwick Clayton has sent me a small number of photos from Manfeild, and an OSCA invasion with several teams making their way up from the South Island. He didn't say what year this was, but I would guess it could be the 1973/74 season?

Anyway, here is, first up, our own Roaring Season member, Paul Kirk.

Attachment 4714

Trevor Crowe in the Chevy powered Corolla.

Attachment 4715

I think this is Robert Bartley in the V8 Cortina? Wasn't this a North Island car?

Attachment 4717

Clyde Collins in his V8 Cortina

Attachment 4716

And a couple more. Lawrence Bruce in the ex Kennett/Dunlop/Haig Shelby Mustang.

Attachment 4719

Alec Dickie in the Chevy Victor.

Attachment 4720

Attachment 4718

When I get organized I will post something of the early OSCA things, I have scanned numerous photo's and articles for the 40th reunion, some of which could be of interest,maybe I should get PK's consent first.