Yes Roger, as you can see very simple, you can buy the kit with a motor, or supply your own motor, same engine as the 1.5 litre Jazz here. hundreds in a junk yard near you all. Engines bullet proof, bodies rust quicker than lightening. Wal, HPD has the costs on their webb site, and you can access the tech regs on line through the SCCA.
Roger
Some very good points have been raised for and against continuing with the outdated Kent engine. Oviously Ford NZ don't give a damn....they've milked the publicity for years at no cost so them, so my feeling is that the time has come for a major manufacturer to step into the breech and provide fully sealed engines as Toyota do in the TRS. Ford could consider this option or just go to hell!
I personally know two Formula Ford champions who openly admitted cheating to win their championships. This ain't good enough boys and another reason why many competitors can't be bothered continuing with racing FF. As for the "shock absorber" craziness! Total "$" bullshit!
"Daddy! I want to win the FF championship" All you have to do is provide me with the best engineer available and I'll do the rest.
"Okay son"
CRAP! and counter productive to promoting the best driver.
I have been watching with interest and i'll throw in my 2 cents.
I raced FF championship for 2 seasons (mid pack runner) during the earily 90's. Both years , The budget was around 25k. This included leasing a car and leasing an engine from GLC and to run a car for a season. I got an awful lot of help from the people involved with Historics at the time. A good friend took the summer from his paying job and Mum/Dad (Bev/Ian) came to every race. Even The trailer was loaned to us.
In the second year, the engine was out for a refresh after every 3rd meeting.
What we did not have, and nor do I think it should be allowed in a "starter" class is a digital dash with data acc. and radios . we also did not have a carb with all the trick stuff in it.
As for current costs, A new FF kent with Iron head was supplied by Loynings engine service last year for US$8500 carbs to tilton Clutch at 114BHP.
New Kent parts (block/crank/rods/pistions /carbs are available from Pegusas Auto racing. Jay Ivey (Ivey Engines) has the new alloy Cylinder heads for about 2500 complete .
Perhaps those in Wellington could invest in the future of NZ open wheel racing....lease the new spec alloy heads with a NZ built EFI and NZ (link ?) sealed ECU ? Also go to a spec shock also.....my 2 cents
Tony Garmey
Raymond - have MotorSport NZ been talking to Toyota about Formula Ford? Could they be interested in extending the staircase of talent? - Toyota are heavily involved, and thanks be for that, but how would they feel if a Honda or Hyundai or whatever wanted to really invest in a replacement for F.Ford?
Totally agree. What FF has to do to be a first single seater experience, is make it easier for the family teams to get started without having to shell out for too many "extras". The real driving talent is then easier to spot.Originally Posted by Horizon
The same then applies later in life when the baby boomers head for the historic grids just to enjoy themselves. They don't need those extras either - but it is surprising how many tripods are lined up trackside in some classes!
Also agree with Ray and Tony - good points.
Totally agree with that.
With regard to engines whilst MSNZ should probably be putting out feelers to manufacturers about replacement engines in the longer term. It is a fact that FF world wide is in a state of flux at present with no international consistency. We have Ecoboost in the UK, Honda Fit in the US, and the old Fiesta engine in Oz. And Toyota as far as I am aware nowhere.
Personally whilst I think it makes good sense to align with Australia, they are running old engines. Honda in the US has got right behind this one and I think that is the best option. It is a new engine and they have said they will maintain a full parts inventory for 10 years after the motor is discontinued. $US2500 for a new engine and about $US5000 to convert it to race spec compatible with the Kent performance. This means the Kent can run competitively alongside the Honda cars and as people slowly destroy their "unreliable, expensive to maintain Kents" (not my words) they will all no doubt eventually go the Honda way.
But until we see how the international situation pans out I think it would be foolish to rush in with new engines of any sort at this time. Prepare the groundwork for it, yes, but don't jump in just yet.
Instead concentrate on providing venues for relatively low cost racing for the many existing cars owned by enthusiasts throughout the country.
Yes
Agree
The last two rounds the form. 1st have put on some real good racing ,so we dont wont to forget about them.
Going back to leasing a mtr. costs $15000, and saving your own good mtr.at the end of the season adding what your mtr. cost my guess you have a total of $30,000 invested..And as to the BS about cheats ,what the tec. officers put Ritchie through was unbelevable ,at the first round his carb had an extra screw than the rest ,they worked out it did nothing to gain any more power ,so was ok, next round was repeat ,plus between the two races on the Sun. they {Mike Clements } wished to check the wheel bearings,needing all the brakes ect to come apart, he was refused, .Then the last round it was close between Ritchie and Mitch, on the Sat. Ritchie had it in the bag by winning, only two races to go on Sun. Then on Sun. morning Ritchie disqualified ,has an extra screw that does nothing, no points and has to start at the rear,.Well what a race three times he passed Mitch around the outside of Champion down the back Mitch powered past only to have Ritchie repeat the move and draw away,.But does not say much for our tect officers
wonder where "those guys" were when I got kicked to the curb being 1.25 THOU over on valve lift..LOL
They normally finished up in ???? pits drinking coffie or stronger at the end of day
Raymond - you answered yes, butto which question?
Probably the same place when I was 10 seconds late to catch the interislander ferry. I was late and you exceded the permitted valve lift. In both cases it was our problem and not that of those who enforced the requirements
Sorry Micheal for being unclear. Yes; MSNZ and Toyota have had ongoing discussions for over a year regarding saving F/Ford. They like mSNZ see it as essential with regards to keeping a "potential competitor pool of locals" amoungst other things. As for the second part of your post; only Toyota can/should answer that...not me.
It has always been easier to compete in any class with a big budget and the last couple of seasons have certainly seen some kids winning with ambitious fathers who spent mega bucks. However FF still offers the chance to be reasonably competitive on a smaller budget if you are savvy and seek good advice. There are some specific areas where well thought out regulations/ restrictions would help in this regard, particularly in the shock absorber area and series supplied camshafts and intake manifolds but the basic concept is still valid and does not need major changes.
Long term there is no doubt that some replacement engine will be needed, modern "plug in" technology makes parity much easier to manage and I don't think the class owes any loyalty to Ford at all as they have put nothing in for years. However, rather than reinvent the wheel NZ is better to see Worldwide which replacement package is best and follow that. The Honda option looks promising.
Short term however, I think the reason for the small fields in the National Championship is much closer to home. Everyone knows the promotion side of MNZ has had its problems and although they are unrelated to FF, because of these issues the whole series and its calendar was uncertain until the last moment. I personally know of one potential front running competitor for whom the lack of a definite series calendar meant that he decided not to compete this year at all. No doubt he was not the only one who made this decision and MNZ need to have a series planned and dates set for next year NOW, not 6 weeks before the series begins.
Howard has hit the nail on the head on all three major issues facing FF.
Talking to one of the front runners at Taupo their shock absorber package $18000 and data logger $12000. Enough said.!!!!
The Honda Fit seems to work well in the States.
Consistent, certain leadership is what MSNZ needs to display to all its members.They must remember who is "paying the piper"
We have just completed the latest Formula Ford season and our budget was tiny compaired to the one's everyone is referring to. If you want to go out and spend unlimited amounts then that is your option but not ours.
I don't see where the expense comes from in the Kent engine, sure it maybe expensive to build a new engine but to freshen one up to last a season is no more than $5000.00. As for the shocks we ran on the standard non adjustable Bilsteins that the car was built with, we did have them rebuilt a couple of seasons ago. Our budget for the entire season was less that the cost of the shocks and data logger on the car above. We weren't just there to fill the field up and we were unlucky not to win the championship, 1 missed gear in race 1 at Taupo was all it took as the season was that close. We didn't have paid engineers but ran our car the same as we had run our karts before, with a couple of friends helping, Included in our budget was travel and accomodation.
I do aggree that the seasons calander needs to be out early to make it easier to plan ahead.
Last season the South Island competitors had 2 trips to the North Is
Barry you are very lucky that you can do it all yourselve,most others cant and someone has to keep the engine builders happy
And Brendon drove well, you must be pleased.
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