Event: 2013 Australian Muscle Car Masters

[aaron]

Yes it is disappointing Terry. Full credit to those who made the effort to run their F5000s at this event. Just a shame there weren't more of them. I know these cars aren't cheap to run, and neither is it shipping them around Australia or from New Zealand. This is obviously an event outside their existing championship, and maybe the MCM organisers need to somehow find a way to make this part of their series.

I remember asking Mark Oastler about this following the very first Muscle Car Masters, back in 2005 (?) as the intention back then was to have F5000s there. I think initially from memory they'd advertised that F5000s would be at that first event, but in the end it came to nothing. He told me many of those running the F5000s, especially those from NZ, weren't very interested in racing at the MCM. They felt it wasn't the right fit for their class. Thats what he said back then. I actually suggested the NZ racing class Central Muscle Cars could be a good fit with MCM (because I was involved with CMC back then), an idea he really liked, and the idea sort of grew from there to have CMC at the event. Thats back when CMC cars were a bit closer to historic type cars than they are now.

I was involved with Mark on that and tried to get 4 cars to do demo laps. In the end I was the only one there with the Chevron and it rained about 6" so I didn't venture onto the track. Just goes to show how long it can take to get these things together. Australia is a big country and competition between meetings and driver support can be difficult. Credit to MCM as we get free entry to that meeting as an incentive. It's still a long way to bring cars from Melbourne and NZ.
Sandown 500 this weekend and it looks like we have 14 cars at the moment.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Aaron, I hope the F5000 support for MCM grows. But as you say, there is strong competition between event promoters to have F5000 on the programme. Seeing them charging around Sandown would be pretty special.

[richiev8]

Steve,

Cheers, but taking no credit for its current performance, thinks its had several large bundles of $$ thrown at it!, new owner does say its the nicest build in the feild

[Snoozin]

These pics are great! Man I'd love to get over to Aus and trackside, looks like great fun!

[Terry S]

Yes it is disappointing Terry. Full credit to those who made the effort to run their F5000s at this event. Just a shame there weren't more of them. I know these cars aren't cheap to run, and neither is it shipping them around Australia or from New Zealand. This is obviously an event outside their existing championship, and maybe the MCM organisers need to somehow find a way to make this part of their series.

I remember asking Mark Oastler about this following the very first Muscle Car Masters, back in 2005 (?) as the intention back then was to have F5000s there. I think initially from memory they'd advertised that F5000s would be at that first event, but in the end it came to nothing. He told me many of those running the F5000s, especially those from NZ, weren't very interested in racing at the MCM. They felt it wasn't the right fit for their class. Thats what he said back then. I actually suggested the NZ racing class Central Muscle Cars could be a good fit with MCM (because I was involved with CMC back then), an idea he really liked, and the idea sort of grew from there to have CMC at the event. Thats back when CMC cars were a bit closer to historic type cars than they are now.

Re disappointing F5000 appearance
Steve this IS a round of their Australian Championship. Their Australian association set up a 5 round "2013/2014 F5000 Australia Cup".
A great idea for us all to see them. Alas this was the ONLY Sydney round, the other 4 are all in Melbourne. So in Sydney we have to wait another year.
What is frustraing is poor attendance by their own association. From their web site the office holders are the President, Deputy President and Secretary. None of these three turned up. Why did they bother setting up a championship.
The thing about F5000 is not the racing and dicing but the great impact of a reasonable field at full noise.
Surely these guys can afford to run 5 meetings a year. If not why not sell the cars to those who can?

[Steve Holmes]

Yikes, I didn't realise this was a round of the series Terry.

[Steve Holmes]

Some more pics from Brent.

[Steve Holmes]

[Steve Holmes]

[aaron]

I'm no oil painting but that's not bad. I looked on Atspeed but couldn't find how to get some of the great photos.

[aaron]

Terry, yes we were also disappointed but did our best at Sandown. Can you believe that there are now repercussions because we were too fast? By the way, I have now run 5 meetings this year including 3 in NZ. I know you are not criticising me and respect your viewpoint. We all wish for the Cinderella formula but it may have been the 3 years we ran at the AGP. We are only doing this for fun. I can only imagine how difficult it must have been in period.

[Steve Holmes]

Aaron, in what way did the AGP appearances affect F5000?

[Steve Holmes]

I'm no oil painting but that's not bad. I looked on Atspeed but couldn't find how to get some of the great photos.

Brent can be contacted on: atspeedimages@hotmail.com

[aaron]

Aaron, in what way did the AGP appearances affect F5000?

The AGP fields were the largest ever in this country by far and that was the pinnacle. It will be hard to ever match that. It is an expensive exercise and having done it 2 or 3 times many decided (Kiwis in particular) that it was better value to run 3 or 4 meetings in a row in NZ. They still get big grids there, we are struggling here.

[Murray Maunder]

Aaron,
Does the distances involved in Australia have a bearing on the demise of this great class in Aussie? Or escalating costs? Or something else or a combination (probably)? Maybe a thread specifically to discuss here at TRS like the one that FF had recently, would be worthwhile. I am worried to think that F5000 as an historic class in Australasia could be heading for virtual extinction. The fields and the red flags and number of retirements at this year's Festival were alarming after the spectacle of previous years.

[Steve Holmes]

Yes thats a good point Murray. The little understanding I have of the New Zealand F5000 group, and speaking to some of those involved, is that there is becoming a bit of a division between those who are genuine enthusiasts, who want to run the cars for enjoyment and historic sentiment, without the association of a championship to battle for, and those who are serious about winning the championship, chasing points etc, and are spending big to achieve these goals. I don't know how serious it is, and of course if there is a championship to contend for, this will always happen.

[aaron]

Yes thats a good point Murray. The little understanding I have of the New Zealand F5000 group, and speaking to some of those involved, is that there is becoming a bit of a division between those who are genuine enthusiasts, who want to run the cars for enjoyment and historic sentiment, without the association of a championship to battle for, and those who are serious about winning the championship, chasing points etc, and are spending big to achieve these goals. I don't know how serious it is, and of course if there is a championship to contend for, this will always happen.

You are both right although I don't think we had any red flags at MCM? Not at Sandown in the races. Cost, distance, competitive v enthusiast, engine power battle, age of drivers, all of these things are playing a part. If the grids settle back at what it was 5-6 years ago it can still be a good show.

[Steve Holmes]

I am sure the current economic climate can't help either, these are not cheap cars to run.

[Steve Holmes]

[Steve Holmes]

Its interesting the way historic racing jumbles up history. A Group A Mustang couldn't win an ATCC race in 1985, much less beat an R32 Nissan Skyline when it first appeared on the scene 4-5 years later. But this is a part of what makes historic racing so interesting. Seeing all these different cars running together.