From the 1968 NZGP programme.
(Ken H)
From the 1968 NZGP programme.
(Ken H)
Roger,
This has the word Northern in it and I thought you might be interested in this scene from 1957 in the 1958 NZGP programme.
(Ken H )
Ken H,Originally Posted by khyndart in CA
Roger,
This has the word Northern in it and I thought you might be interested in this scene from 1957 in the 1958 NZGP programme.
(Ken H )
I am sure there is a connection - this Northern Sports Car Club and a Triumph guy 3 times with a GT6, The TR4A IRS Overdrive and a 2.5 P. I. used to go mainly to Collett and Fleming the Triumph and later BL dealers in Point Chevalier, but most of their stuff came via Northern Automobiles, so that is the connection.
" COLLETT & FLEMING LIMITED was registered as New Zealand Limited Company on 04 Nov 1948, registered at 133 Vincent Street, Auckland , New Zealand. "
Company was deregistered in 1990 but Neil Hyde took over the business [ premises and trade ] in 1984 and Hyde Automotive is now in New Lynn where I used to work late 1980's 1985 to 1992 - two stints, New Lynn has many Automotive Specialists, and my MGB used to go there for work to be done by an MG Specialist and MG Racer Garth Bagnall,
but I digress !!
Here is the Bob Tullius TR6, being unloaded from a plane - Those TR's get around.
Cheers
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 09-11-2021 at 05:58 AM. Reason: but I digress ###47
Just going back over the thread ; - as have found out more information about Jack Boot and his involvement with the Roycrofts [ A. J Father and Ron J son ] and the " BugLey " the Riley - Bugatti-Riley or Riley Bugatti - more to come on Jack Boot later.
In the attachment above from Milan Fistonic of " Little Ardmore " in January 1960 meeting are Allan Woolf in a Ford - his Ford 8 and there is in the Sports cars R Billington in the " Elfo Special ".
Had not seen the " Elfo " until I came across this photo. R Billington from Whangarei in the Elfo Special at Levin in 1958. A Ferris De Joux body on the Ford Special it had an 1172 cc side valve Ford 10 motor.
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 09-13-2021 at 04:07 AM.
There is a plan for a Celebration by " The Older Guard " of the Club to hold an event at the Clubrooms in Mount Richmond Domain in August 2022 .. Rod Peat, Mal Clark and others are giving advanced notice.
There does not appear to be anything " Official " from the Club.
We shall wait and see !!.
2022 would be the 80th Anniversary of the first gatherings of the group that formed the Club in 1943 - formally at a meeting in July 1943 and it was Incorporated in October of 1943, I understand - all this with a War going on..
All sorts of restrictions - petrol and food rationing, etc,
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 04-17-2023 at 04:37 AM.
" Competitors Car Club ". [ Italics mine - see note ]
Had read about this Club originally from Bob Homewood with a report on a Race Meeting at Seagrove, Manukau in 1947/48. Later got the full report from Graeme Staples - known as Spyda in Motor Cycle racing circles
Re-reading the Book - A Limited Edition by NZ Classic Car Magazine entitled " Classic Kiwi Motorsport " published in 2004.
The article some 50 pages was a series of seven article that had previously appeared in the magazine about Ron Roycroft.
It states that the Competitors Club was an " unofficial ' intersection ' club within NZMRDC [ later Auckland Car Club ] and NSCC, which organised the races at Seagrove on a monthly basis over the Summer.
This would have been just prior to the formation of the ANZCC, Association of New Zealand Car Clubs around 1948/50 [ must clarify ]
An extract from the Book ;
The original article from Bob Homewood and Graeme Staples archives.
Note the report is 1949 the event is late 1948. - November.
Pages 21 and 22 of Motor Sport Nostalgia publication
[ posted before - provide the explanation for the CC ]
The results in respect of those early meanings may appear confusing. I attended a couple and it was notable that those driving shiny production sports cars, seemed to be out on a Sunday drive and in no way stressed their rare and valuable machinery. Where as the drivers of specials and the like were hard at it. It is not surprising that Laurie Powell overtook the field in a handicap race. It is also significant that Dr. Ken Orr's very new Jowet Jupiter was not being driven by its owner when rolled. Not to say that Gordon brown was reckless.
Medical officer at many important motor races, Ken Orr was my chosen GP until he became specialist in physical medicine. Laurie Powell was also a patient. I recall when I attended Ken's surgery at night, I would often let others in the waiting room go ahead of me, so that I was last to receive attention. As a result we often talked fast cars well into the night.
One conversation involved an incident which occurred when Ken Wharton was killed driving his Monza Ferrari in the sports car race, run at Ardmore together with the NZIGP. Ken described how during the high speed run to Hospital in the back of an ambulance, he and an assistant bored a hole in the patients head using a screw driver, as a means of releasing blood pressing on the brain, but to no avail.
Together with Laurie Powell I manned a flag point at the this unfortunate event. We were close to a tight but fat corner and I can truly say that this was the only time I have seen a car properly drifted. Ken Wharton braked the Ferrari absolutely on the limit, then set it up under brakes somewhat side ways to drift the car into and through the corner under a balanced throttle. He then opened up to roar off with the minimum of wheelspin and repeated this on each lap, until he ceased to appear. What is more he drove sitting back with straight arms.
If any one is interested I can advise as to the exact reason for the accident.
The late Ken Orr was an excellent doctor and continued in practice through to a good old age. When I asked why? He replied "why not".
He called in at my home on the way home one evening to collect a copy of my book and paid on the spot. It was good to see him. He was small in stature and quiet of voice, but a very big man.
Last edited by Trevor Sheffield; 09-23-2021 at 01:24 PM. Reason: Addition.
Trevor, thank you for your story.
" If any one is interested I can advise as to the exact reason for the accident."
The Ken Wharton accident has been the subject of quite a few comments and statements about what actually happened. Have read a few in books,but not from the newspapers of the day.
Your close proximity " Together with Laurie Powell I manned a flag point at the this unfortunate event." to the accident
I for one would appreciate your comments.
Regarding Dr Ken Orr and his cars - have also read a little about them and Gordon Brown Racing his car and others.
Please keep contributing to this thread,
Northern Sports Car Club website actually has a link to the TRS " unofficial story " of the Clubs early years, which I started as being about the 1940's information from my late Uncle but now goes forward into the 1980's and even a bit from later.
With the 50th year celebration of the NSCC Clubrooms next year, and it being the 80th Anniversary of when a few Sports Car enthusiast got together in mid 1942, 2022 should be a big year for the Club.
I confess I have not managed to get to the Club to go through all those Club Torque magazines that you contributed back to the Club.
I unfortunately disposed of all of mine from 1967 to 1980 - now regret that happening.
..
"Your close proximity " Together with Laurie Powell I manned a flag point at the this unfortunate event." to the accident
I for one would appreciate your comments."
The huge disparity in respect of road speed between the front to back runners caused grave concern. Officialdom lacking racing experience wrongly set down an extraordinary rule whereby overtaking was only allowed on the outside.
Furthermore instructions covering the rule were issued only verbally at the drivers meeting. The was no guarantee that they were properly heard or correctly understood. Nor was there any check or confirmation ensuring that all drivers were present. Some drivers did verbally raise objections but to no avail.
A slow car driver observed a fast car coming up on his rear. There was maximum room to his left, therefore he moved gradually over towards his right so as to provide even more space. The fast overtaking driver assumed that he must abide by the rule and attempted to overtake on the right. The slower car inadvertently slowly shut him out and he was forced to run wide beyond the edge of the course and climbed an obstruction which in any event should not have been so close.
The officials were the direct cause of the accident by upsetting normal well known and expected, racing rules and procedure for no good reason. There was no logic involved in imposing a specific and extraordinary rule for a single and individual race. It was tantamount to requiring daily drivers to revert to driving on the right within only a small section of a city.
I heard Rolly Crowther say that the faster car should have simply driven straight through the slower car. However it was a fact that the fast driver was a sportsman, a gentleman and that would not have been cricket.
Last edited by Trevor Sheffield; 09-30-2021 at 08:57 AM. Reason: Addition.
A bit more of the story of " Bugley " the Bugatti Riley or Riley Bugatti - cut down Bugatti chassis from a car that A J Roycroft owned - The car was created by Arthur Dexter R A Dexter, son of Reuben A Dexter in 1938.
Dexter senior was a car dealer as was A J Roycroft.
A photo of the car with " Dexter Motors " notation in 1938 - appears in the book " Flat to the Boards " from Ron Roycroft archives
Photo that my Late Uncle Ed Dowding had of his brother - in - law Jack Boot sitting in his car in 1944 at Huntly Cinder Track where Ron Roycroft raced it for Jack.
A bit of the story of the car and Jack Boots involvement - we [ family ] believe Jack owned it from early 1943, and it was sold to Morrie Proctor " after the war " as Jack passed on 27th February 1945 from " Tb " ( tuberculosis ).
He was only 28 according to family information - born in 1917.
both of these extracts from the " Flat to the Boards " book give some detail of the origins of the car - they are the Postscript in the book entitled " Where are they Now " Page 169.
The Bugatti was a type 23 .. A J Roycroft had also owned a Type 13 and bits from that were used too !
Later of course Ron had the type 35 that is currently the Bugatti-Jaguar with Ron's son Terry Roycroft.
This extract is not correct as " After World War 11 it was sold to Jack Boot " - that would have been when family sold it after Jack's passing in 1945 - we presume to Morrie Proctor
The connection to Northern Sports car Club is the people.
- Jack Boot was a founding member and on the first Committee when he owned Bugley, Ron and A J Roycroft were both early members and my other Uncle A E " Eddie " Dowding [ Oct 1919 - May 2018 ] was the 2nd President in 1945 -46 year.
Vern Clarke the inaugural President 1943 -45, when Ed was Club Captain 1944 - 45 as I understand.
Ron Roycroft was also born in 1917 [ passed away in 2000 ] ;
There is a School connection too Ron went to Bayfield Primary in Herne Bay in 1922, my Father Mac Dowding 1917 - 1999 was there from 1927 as was Eddie Dowding - they may been at the school at the same time. -[ have just established that my Father, Mac and Uncle, Ed, arrived in New Zealand with their mother and her sister on 30th December 1926 in Wellington, and then travelled by train to Auckland arriving in early January 1927 ]
Bayfield was also my Primary school from 1952 to 1955, then we moved to New Lynn.
Ron and family A J and mother were living at 44 Albany Road when Ron was born - the house is still there.
The Roycroft family moved to Helensville, where A J had a garage but I do not know the year [ mid / late 1920's or early 1930's - at the moment ]
The Dowding Boys [ with their mother, my Grandmother - she was widowed in 1919 ] lived at 42 Sentinel Road, from early 1927 on - on the other side [ harbour side ] of Jervois Road, Herne Bay. I lived at No 42 from 1947 to 1955
Their Uncle and Aunt lived at 88 Sarsfield Street from 1923, that house was finally sold from the family by myself in 1995, having lived there from 1981, after my grandmother Dad and Ed's mother passed away in late 1980.
Ed and Jack were good Mates as brothers - in - law, and both heavily involved with cars - Ed taught a young Bruce McLaren at Seddon Technical Institute, when it was still in the City.
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 12-13-2021 at 06:10 AM. Reason: more info #### 47
" Northern Sports Car Club – Hill Climbs 1960’s
1960's
" Ostrich Farm Road, Pukekohe, Franklin County "
11/10/1961 Ostrich Farm Road
November 1961 **
17/12/1961 Ostrich Farm Road, Pukekohe - the NSCC's Gold Star Championship Hill Climb
October 1962 Ostrich Farm Road
As noted ; ** Used in 1961 as have some results from an event there in November 1961 posted in previous thread post #327
" Wharepapa Road, Helensville " - used 1960's ** maybe 1965 - now seems likely this was after Birdwood Road - see dates now added.
1964.1965
" Birdwood Road, Massey "
14/03/1965 Birdwood Road Massey -
Birdwood Road, Massey - area now called Birdwood as Massey is a large area. used 1964 - 65, did they keep using it until Cosseys was first used in March 1967 ?.
Then we have Wharepapa -both roads used in 1965.
" Wharepapa Road, Helensville "
-/12/1965 Wharepapa Road
“ Kiwitahi Road, Woodhill near Helensville “ ** newly noted venue - noted by Bob Homewood to be close to Tom Grace's farm which backed on to the Woodhill Forest, -Kiwitahi Road, is near Wharepapa Road
1966
" Wright Road, Brookby " - 1966
In use after Wharepapa Road - have a report from an event in 1966 - this is a new location / event in the timeline. with Wharepapa Road used in December 1965.
1967
" Cosseys Farm Road "
By March 1967 NSCC had " built " " Cosseys Farm Road " into a Hill Climb venue - cowpats and all.
"
This is a photo of Gerry ... in his Riley at an NSCC Hillclimb around 1966, with a bit of a story and the photo from John ( Larry ) Lawton.
The brief story - " Gerry Smaller in his Riley Elf. Unfortunately Gerry wrote this off not long after this was taken when he lost it under braking at the Pukekohe Club circuit and hit a flag marshal's barrier. I think this shot was taken at a Northern Sports Car Club hillclimb that was somewhere between Waimauku and Helensville. I think that they only used that venue once. Think I competed in my mini. Would be interested to know if my memory is correct if there any NSCC historians out there who would like to comment ".
Comments included one from Bob Homewood mentioning Kiwitahi Road, near Tom Grace's farm so that could be the location - before my time in NSCC. Others may know more !!
Dennis Green a fellow NSCC member in the 1970's was also Club Photographer and took 1000's of photos at various events.
Recently Ross Cammick got hold of a couple of large boxes of Dennis' photo collection - mainly negatives which he has been scanning and identifying to preserve the images;
A small selection - including two of myself in my first Sprite FD8739 a 1965 Mark 3 Sprite which was painted yellow when I acquired it in early 1974, It had a Black factory hardtop and a Black stripe across the boot and down the rear of the guards behind the wheel arch.
Main competitors for the NSCC Sports Car Trophy for the 1974/75 speed/trial season were myself in the Sprite and Rob Williams in his Allard. Rob did Sprints Hillclimbs and Autocross/Gymkhana events and I competed in Autocross Hillclimbs and Trials.in 1975 we shared the trophy.
1974 an Autocross / Grass Sprint at I think Tom Grace Farm at Woodhill, It is definately West Auckland
Rob in the Allard ;
Attachment 70828
A Monaro - probably Mark Parsons who owned several in the 1970's - at the Autocross.
Attachment 70829
The Sprite ;
Attachment 70830
Attachment 70831
1975 - Gold Star Hillclimb at Cosseys Farm, in January '75 - Cosseys Farm the Clubs Hill venue since March 1967
A Monaro -
Rob Williams in the Allard ; John Williams the owner of the car from 1962 to 1967 obtained the AL7285 number plate in 1964 by seeking the AL prefix at the Post Office.
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 11-18-2021 at 06:37 AM. Reason: Check photos ### 47
Robs V8 powered cars a couple more photos..
Photo from Milan
Dennis Green photo
1974 an Autocross / Grass Sprint at I think Tom Grace Farm at Woodhill, It is definately West Auckland
Rob in the Allard ; big crowd on the hill
A Monaro - probably Mark Parsons who owned several in the 1970's - at the Autocross.
The Sprite ;
The photos appear when clicked on but unsure why not displaying in the earlier post.
[ I did take a long time loading the first four -
ERC may know
- bearing in mind that my laptop is 12 years old and needs a cleanup ]
It is a long story, to be told later, but here are a couple of photos of a Ford Fairmont, being driven hard in 1975 ..
More details to follow in a couple of weeks - all will be revealed
A Dennis Green, photo - recently located by Ross Cammick from Dennis' huge collection of negatives.
Cosseys Farm Hill Climb in 1974 - 17th March - see Milan's notes [ car sold in June 1974 - replaced with the first of 4 Austin Healey Sprites ].
Woodhill - Tom Grace Farm NSCC Autocross another Dennis Green photo - from a print I bought from Dennis at the time.
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 12-19-2021 at 06:09 AM. Reason: correction *** ### 47 ..
I think these results are from the March 17, 1974 event at Cossey's Farm.A Dennis Green, photo - recently located by Ross Cammick from Dennis' huge collection of negatives.
Cosseys Farm Hill Climb in 1974 [ could be 1972 or 73 as sold the car in March 1974 ].
You also competed in an Autocross event at Tom Grace's place on March 3, 1974. That could be where the other photo was taken
Milan, Thank you so much for the information - Ross Cammick told me that Dennis Green didn't really start taking Motorsport photos until 1974.I think these results are from the March 17, 1974 event at Cossey's Farm.
You also competed in an Autocross event at Tom Grace's place on March 3, 1974. That could be where the other photo was taken
That would tie in with Ross' comments to me.
Would like to see the Autocross results too, if they are available, Milan.
My relying on memory is not that accurate, it would seem.
Cheers
Roger
Autocross at Tom Grace's farm on March 3, 1974
" Autocross at Tom Grace's farm on March 3, 1974 ",
Thanks for the results Milan.
Ross has discovered 3 photos of the Mini at this event at Tom Grace's farm on March 3, 1974, and we have worked out that the Autocross photo of the Mini posted earlier is from an event previous to these three - there is no NSCC sticker on the windscreen now and the number plate has been moved to the bumper.
The 3 Dennis Green photos - raising quite a bit of dust ..
Only had one photo of the car competing, until now. 47 years later I have four !. These things take time.
Last edited by Roger Dowding; 12-20-2021 at 10:57 PM.
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