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Thread: Old Race Tracks

  1. #361
    Semi-Pro Racer Paul B's Avatar
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    Gee, there are some great old bangers in those pics above, I love the open cars of that vintage.

    Here is a picture I found of the old Levin race track.
    Name:  IMG_20200702_124926.jpg
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  2. #362
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    Ray,
    I have been delayed with my inputs because I have been reading your wonderful detailed writings of travelling around the States. Thankyou for all the good information, better than any travel guide.

    Paul, I agree about these race cars from this era. Magnificent machines and I will always remember watching Len Southward drive Mr. Muldoon around Pukekohe before the 1976 NZGP. in his 1915 Stutz. # 5.
    Name:  Len Southward and Robert Muldoon. Jan. 1976. NZGP meet at Pukekohe.jpg
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    KH photo.

    Name:  1915 Stutz at Southward Museum..JPG
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    Ken H.

  3. #363
    Originally posted by khyndart in CA
    Ray,
    I have been delayed with my inputs because I have been reading your wonderful detailed writings of travelling around the States. Thankyou for all the good information, better than any travel guide.....
    Glad to have you join in, Ken...

    The best part is the first trip, in which my late wife's diary features. She had different views to me on many of the things we saw, such a shame she couldn't make the later journeys.

    It's no quick read, though, as I'm sure you realise. I think I'm up to 3,500 photos and maps so far. Seventeen circuits plus bits of the Targa Florio and Mille Miglia.

    With regard to this San Diego circuit, I have a friend who lives there in San Diego and who I visited on the second trip. He used to have a big part in the Nissan team in the US, though he came from Adelaide. I'm sure he doesn't know about this track.

  4. #364
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    The 1915 field description;
    With the driver and his "Mechanician"

    Name:  1915 Field.JPG
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    Name:  1915. # 14 rounding corner onto Rosecrans..jpg
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    Famous American driver Barney Oldfield rounding the corner onto Rosecrans in his Maxwell # 14.

    Name:  1915. Onto the long straight on Rosecrans St..jpg
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    1915.Heading along Rosecrans. Note the power poles and spectator parking !

    Name:  1915. Eddie Rickenbacher driving past the grandstand..jpg
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    1915. Eddie Rickenbacher, who later went on to be a famous pilot and air ace, driving his Peugeot down the straight completing another lap. (Note the position of the pole and the spectators !)
    ( Were the power lines moved away for the event and there was not enough time to move the pole ?
    All opinions are welcome !) They were two brave / stupid spectators !



    ( Ken H..)
    Last edited by khyndart in CA; 07-04-2020 at 07:59 AM.

  5. #365
    Quote Originally Posted by khyndart in CA View Post
    The 1915 field description;
    With the driver and his "Mechanician"

    Name:  1915 Field.JPG
Views: 82
Size:  68.5 KB

    Name:  1915. # 14 rounding corner onto Rosecrans..jpg
Views: 76
Size:  173.1 KB
    Famous American driver Barney Oldfield rounding the corner onto Rosecrans in his Maxwell # 14.

    Name:  1915. Onto the long straight on Rosecrans St..jpg
Views: 80
Size:  123.3 KB
    1915.Heading along Rosecrans. Note the power poles and spectator parking !

    Name:  1915. Eddie Rickenbacher driving past the grandstand..jpg
Views: 82
Size:  91.7 KB
    1915. Eddie Rickenbacher, who later went on to be a famous pilot and air ace, driving his Peugeot down the straight completing another lap. (Note the position of the pole and the spectators !)



    ( Ken H..)
    no flour spray cans to mark the hazard in those days either

  6. #366
    They certainly knew how to throw up grandstands those days...

  7. #367
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    In 1915 spectator safety was not a top priority as seen in this image showing # 19 Duesenberg powering through the turn going up Chatsworth Blvd.

    Name:  1915 race on Chatsworth - Copy.JPG
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    Here an MGB powers through the same corner in this 2019 photo.

    Name:  Chatsworth Blvd...JPG
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Size:  64.0 KB


    (Ken H..)

  8. #368
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    1915. The illustrious Barney Oldfield with the usual cigar clenched between his teeth, driving his Maxwell down Canon St.
    His mechanician, George Hill, is hanging on but they seem to be enjoying themselves.
    (Note the horses off to the right with their harnesses set up to grade the track surface. The track was surfaced with disintegrated granite. DG. )

    Name:  1915. Coming down Canon St..jpg
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    (Ken H..)

  9. #369
    We call that 'decomposed granite' here, Ken...

    Wonderful stuff, smooths out nicely and provides a good slippery surface.

  10. #370
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    Ray,
    I got my 1915 DG input from this;
    Name:  1915. Barney Oldfield...JPG
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  11. #371
    I see... 'as DG was called back then.'

    So maybe they now call it 'decomposed granite' as I'm used to.

    This is all pretty good stuff, Ken, can you keep it coming?

  12. #372
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    The three Peugeot entered in the race all had engine failures due to broken connecting rods which may have been due to oil supply issues during the long climbs on the course compared to racing at Indianapolis and Savannah etc. on flat tracks.
    Due to the war in Europe it was hard / impossible to get replacement parts. One of the drivers, Bob Burman, made arrangements to have his own replacement engine built by his friend, Harry Miller after this event.

    Name:  1915. Bob Burman in his Peugeot # 6 - Copy.jpg
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    Bob Burman at the 1915 start with mechanician Eric Schrader in Peugeot # 6.

    Name:  1915. # 6 Peugeot with a blown engine.jpg
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    After 7 laps of the 6 mile course the Burman Peugeot was out with a broken connecting rod. Burman and Schrader checking the damage.
    (Excuse what may be a dumb question but what did this machine use for brakes ?)

    Name:  1915. # 9 Peugeot with a blown engine..jpg
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    Another Peugeot # 9 out with broken connecting rod.
    ( Judging by the hats the ladies got well dressed up for this racing occasion in San Diego. ( Jan. 9th. 1915.)




    (Ken H..)
    Last edited by khyndart in CA; 07-08-2020 at 05:54 AM.

  13. #373
    The Peugeots came from racing in Europe which were not flat courses. As you say Ken it sounds like a lubrication issue, but for me it doesn't stack up to say the hills were causal. Maybe the mechanician had a role in pumping oil as they did for fuel tank pressure? I'm now on the hunt for info! Keep them coming please.
    Brakes, rear only, just like my one. I could post a pic, but would be OT.

  14. #374
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    Rhys,
    Why was the braking to the rear wheels only on such a large machine ?



    Ken

  15. #375
    Simple...

    4-wheel brakes were yet to be developed.

    Oh yes, there were hills...



    This is the 5-mile straight on the circuit on which these cars made their successful debut. And this...



    ...is a part of the return leg on that circuit. Hills were not steep, but they were there, and there was plenty of sustained speed.

    These photos are going up tonight in the next episode of my trip thread. My last day in Europe.
    Last edited by Ray Bell; 07-08-2020 at 07:56 AM.

  16. #376
    It was probably a whole lot more windy when they raced there too!

  17. #377
    Brakes, check this out! http://www.grandprixhistory.org/peug1912.htm
    Perhaps the Americans took them off because they show on the site I have copied. It doesn't give the year though for the pics showing brakes, although does say 1912 .
    Lubrication; reading more I discover they were dry sump engines, front and rear mains were roller bearings, and the centre one a double row ball bearing. It doesn't give any clues to big ends.
    Another link https://primotipo.com/2015/12/11/191...y-its-engines/
    Last edited by Oldfart; 07-08-2020 at 12:35 PM.

  18. #378
    I went through all that stuff and saw no front brakes...

    A transmission brake and, in the case of the EX3 and L76 models, external contracting rear brakes. Internal expanding rears came on the 3-litre models built from the end of 1913.

  19. #379
    Originally posted by Oldfart
    It was probably a whole lot more windy when they raced there too!
    Windy? I don't see the relevance.

  20. #380
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell View Post
    Windy? I don't see the relevance.
    Windy road (not wind) sharper corners, steeper climbs than the smoothed out roads a century later?
    Last edited by Oldfart; 07-08-2020 at 02:10 PM.

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