Thank you for that. And I well remember the fuss associated with race/rally cars here for a season.
Thank you for that. And I well remember the fuss associated with race/rally cars here for a season.
Mr G went on to race a few McLaren cars on his return to the UK worth a google!Originally Posted by Howard Wood
And I thought a Lola T190 F5000
Be interesting if Bill P has a photo of Bobby Brown taking the right front wheel off from his T190 while exiting the pits at Teretonga during practice 1971
Great photos Bill - hope you don't mind as we wander off and recall the past!!
Last edited by Kwaussie; 07-25-2013 at 10:44 AM.
Not to mention the two American 5000s which arrived with their side-tanks packed with drugs...
Bill, I am trouble finding the mag now. My memory of it was about Minis in Feb 1969 Motorman- does that sound correct?
Did they smell nice when they fired them up!
Although originally Part 1 of this thread was only going to have 24 photos in it (because Bill had sent me a cd containing 48 photos), he has since emailed me through several more photos, so I kept extending the thread. But this will be the last photo from this part, before I begin Part 2 shortly. And to end Part 1, is the photo that headed up this thread, of Ulf Norinder, at speed, in his magnificent Lola at Teretonga. What a beautiful photo!
My thanks again to Bill for sharing this incredible collection with us.
At last, finally found this-F.Turner Alfa Romeo Special from p.29 Motorman July 1968.
David Mckinney- you had the correct man.
Doesnt figure in the results.
Last edited by John McKechnie; 07-28-2013 at 06:14 AM.
I'm far from an engineer or aerodynamics expert, but the Lola T190 just looks wrong to me
Not wrong there , might have been set up for pikes peak .......... elllch should not judge
That one in particular Michael, or T190s in general?
Great stuff John, thanks.
To be fair Steve, my comment is made with the benefit of knowing they were duds in period - it was only when Frank Gardner lengthened the wheelbase, and created the T192 in doing so, that the car 'came good'.
But the short wheelbase just looks wrong - but Eric Broadley must have had a theory...
Ulf Norinder had raced a Lola T142 before bringing the T190 to NZ. In answer to my question as to how they compared, he said "Night and day". At the time I thought he meant the T190 was better
This is interesting to me, I didn't realise the T190 wasn't a good car. What was wrong with them?
Steve- At the time I remember reading that this was an early stage of F5000, especially at Tasman Series.
As such some Indianopolis type cars were used- like Eisert Chev.
Big oval cars and not very nimble.
McLarens soon changed that.
Some one with more knowledge than me can fill in more fully and correctly
Yes thats right John, in early Formula A/F5000 years, converted USAC cars were commonly raced. But the T190 was a purpose built Formula A/F5000 chassis. My basic understanding is that it wasn't so much a direct evolution of the T142, which itself was an evolution of the T140, but it must have shared many similarities? The T140 was created from the outset for Formula A/F5000.
The T190 was Lola's third 5000 but really the second design in as far as the 142 was an update of the 140.
In the UK, customers in 1970 could choose between the M10B McLaren - the update of the championship winning 10A from the previous year, the Surtees TS5A - another update, or the Lotus 70. I guess there was the Leda but that was a risky choice - so really the Lola was the only new design from a company with 5000 experience. I would guess that most 190 customers were either 'Lola people' (like Norinder) or those that weren't high enough on the Surtees and McLaren waiting lists.
As far a s a timeline is concerned:
1968 Formula A introduced in the US - the main purpose built customer cars were from Lola, Eagle, Le Grand and McKee. Fields were bolstered by converted USACs and various other stuff including one offs like the Sceptre
FA went to Europe in 1969 and was called Formula 5000 - it is perhaps the only time in history where America adopted Someone else's name for a category that they originally invented
Anyway, McLaren and Surtees introduced customer cars - only one McLaren M10A ever raced in the 69 UK/Europe championship with the majority of them going to the States. I think two or three TS5s raced in the UK but again most of a much smaller production run went to the States. The Eagle was updated but that was pretty much the end for US built 5000s at the sharp end of 5000 grids.
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