What's the answer?

[ERC]

It has transcended beyond being a sport. (Coincidentally, the circus is no longer a drawcard.)

Just like soccer and most professional sports. Money, money, money.

Going to a UK second or even first division soccer match in the 1950's, when a crowd of 40,000+ wasn't unusual, it was a pocket money admission fee.

We have all read books such as Alf Francis, Racing Mechanic and others from the mid 1950's to mid 1960's, or even more recent books such as Bob McMurray's, where the Bernie Ecclestone professionalism and massive sponsorship, not to mention huge numbers of personnel and their corporate entertaining, changed F1 for ever.

As someone stated earlier, Bathurst was an annual must see event, even for those of us who had never even heard of it until 1982 so in an effort to bring in parity and control costs (sic), top level motorsport has lost its way so I totally agree with Trevor.

The question asked by Allan is "What's the answer?" I'd add the rider - "If there is one".

Andrew asks WHY costs have sky rocketed and that is a good point.

I have just had a look back at the accounts for the 2009 opening classic weekend at Hampton Downs November 2009. Saturday was Sprints and Classic trial with Club Lotus, and we, (ERC/Monza) ran a race meeting on the Sunday.

I could list all the costs and income for the weekend, but I see very little point, other than MSNZ's coffers benefitted by $5,256 - and since then, MSNZ levies have doubled - as have race licence fees. Why?

The entry fee for racers then was $135 and for Classic Trial and sprints, $110.

Rhys, we paid back a total of $3,500 in returned entry fees (including 1 of $90 and one of $75 as a percentage as they didn't inform us in time).

We paid to have the ERC and BMW E30 races filmed at a cost of $5500 (for us, the same for BMW) and a set of DVD's produced for those who wanted to buy them, at an additional cost.

We had to pay out for rubbish disposal, radio hire, fire extinguisher hire, timekeepers, stewards expenses, programme and ticket printing, breakdown crew, St Johns, secretarial costs, FIV fuel, and voluntarily water for the marshals plus a BBQ at the end of the meeting and a voluntary donation to what would become the Motorsport Club and a couple of helpers.

We made a very small profit and as the first full race meeting at HD, we took about $2,000 on the gate at $20 a weekend ticket. Do the math...

Maybe someone would like to come up with today's charges at HD - and I do hope that one day, someone will work out why the Elf and Safety levy is $25 per DRIVER and what that covers and why per driver?

[Trevor Sheffield]

Just like soccer and most professional sports. Money, money, money.

I could list all the costs and income for the weekend, but I see very little point, other than MSNZ's coffers benefitted by $5,256 - and since then, MSNZ levies have doubled - as have race licence fees. Why?

The entry fee for racers then was $135 and for Classic Trial and sprints, $110.

Rhys, we paid back a total of $3,500 in returned entry fees (including 1 of $90 and one of $75 as a percentage as they didn't inform us in time).

We paid to have the ERC race filmed at a cost of $5500 and a set of DVD's produced for those who wanted to buy them at an additional cost.

We had to pay out for rubbish disposal, radio hire, fire extinguisher hire, timekeepers, stewards expenses, programme and ticket printing, breakdown crew, St Johns, secretarial costs, FIV fuel, and voluntarily water for the marshals plus a BBQ at the end of the meeting and a voluntary donation to what would become the Motorsport Club and a couple of helpers.

We made a very small profit and as the first full race meeting at HD, we took about $2,000 on the gate at $20 a weekend ticket. Do the math...

Maybe someone would like to come up with today's charges at HD - and I do hope that one day, someone will work out why the Elf and Safety levy is $25 per DRIVER and what that covers and why per driver?

ERC, the figures you have quoted are beyond reason, but do not surprise me.

As a competitor and committee member (Hon Sec) of the Northern Sports Car Club, I observed the commencement of the erosion of motor sport with the advent of the first NZ Grand Prix. The anticipated profit was obvious and bureaucracy became established drawn from outside of true motor sport.

Simultaneously, the opportunity to gain positions of power became obvious within ANZCC (Now MSNZ) thus enabling politics to enter the scene, with the key being the monopoly established via the license to Federation Internationale de L’Automobile (“FIA”). And the rest is history.

Speedway, even at this time, was and always had been professional, but apparently did not suffer the same fait. With the money involved in open view there was no hiding of facts and enthusiasts remained at the helm. Check the history of Western Springs Speedway, once very well operated by George C. Smith.

[Andrew Metford]

The question asked by Allan is "What's the answer?" I'd add the rider - "If there is one".

Yes there is an answer, but I don't believe we'll ever see it as there are 1: too many people in high places with conflicting interests; 2: too many in the PC / elf and safety brigade that don't want to accept responsibility for anything, or blame anyone else, so they legislate every single thing so that no one can get hurt or anything else, thereby removing all personality, and the chance to be an individual like the old sports sedans / all comers / etc days, from the sport, and so we end up with Sing Song utes and Toyota 86's at "level 1" meetings. I hate to say it, but the writing has been on the wall for quite a while, and it's not being cleaned up, and doesn't ever look like it will.

TACCOC, HRC, and others have been to the AGM in Wellington several times trying to get well thought-out, common sense changes made to improve things, but get shot down in flames every time, so what's that telling you?

I didn't write what I really wanted to here, because I don't want the website to attract undue legal attention if someone had got their knickers in a twist, but I'm sure you've all read the news articles and the other forum about the wheels falling off, and can read between the lines....

[Trevor Sheffield]

Yes there is an answer, but I don't believe we'll ever see it as there are 1: too many people in high places with conflicting interests;

Andrew, as I explained.

"Simultaneously, the opportunity to gain positions of power became obvious within ANZCC (Now MSNZ) thus enabling politics to enter the scene, with the key being the monopoly established via the license to Federation Internationale de L’Automobile (“FIA”). And the rest is history."

As a result a very cunning undemocratic MSNZ constitution was established with the outcomes you point out. In another forum, some time ago, I pointed out how this could be broken but was ignored.

At the time I also pointed that everyone was pissing into the wind and it would appear that bladders remain full. LOL

[Andrew Metford]

Andrew, as I explained.

"Simultaneously, the opportunity to gain positions of power became obvious within ANZCC (Now MSNZ) thus enabling politics to enter the scene, with the key being the monopoly established via the license to Federation Internationale de L’Automobile (“FIA”). And the rest is history."

As a result a very cunning undemocratic MSNZ constitution was established with the outcomes you point out. In another forum, some time ago, I pointed out how this could be broken but was ignored.

Got a link please? Must have missed that one.